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definition of high performance sidecar
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swaybar2002



Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 380
Location: Central Pa.

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In going along with what Paul stated the future of HPS may turn into...The RUKO Vektor is one sidecar that is much more than a sidecar stuck on a production bike with some mods thrown in.
Check it out by clicking here:
http://www.ruko-fahrzeugtechnik.de/sites_e/home.htm

You will have to click on 'sidecars' at the top of th epage and then 'Vektor'.
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Claude Stanley

Founder: Internet Sidecar Owners Klub
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SCT/

2007
I.S.O.K Sidecar RON-DEE-VOO III ..
First full weekend in August!! Thursday through Sunday!!
Weikert, Pa ..more details coming
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sidecarkeith



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 336
Location: yorkshire uk

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At least their thinking Cool

Thanks for that info, over here I think the Merlin (no not just because I have one) is the most advanced deigned, but even that relies on a bolt on frame.
It's sounds like an advance one frame, maybe the way forward over here.
In England we drive on the left hand side of the road, in Europe they drive on the right. So our market as been limited to a small number of sidecarists, now we are restricte deven more through the European Common Market rules, preventingus selling left hand sidecars aboard and right hand ones here.
Maybe a single frame with engine mid frame could get round the rules since it would neither be right or left handed.
Thanks guys, you've given me something to think about, lets hope mine brain works too Big Grin
Keith
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Bandit Bill



Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 202
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sidecarkeith wrote:
At least their thinking Cool

Thanks for that info, over here I think the Merlin (no not just because I have one) is the most advanced deigned, but even that relies on a bolt on frame.
It's sounds like an advance one frame, maybe the way forward over here.
In England we drive on the left hand side of the road, in Europe they drive on the right. So our market as been limited to a small number of sidecarists, now we are restricte deven more through the European Common Market rules, preventingus selling left hand sidecars aboard and right hand ones here.
Maybe a single frame with engine mid frame could get round the rules since it would neither be right or left handed.
Thanks guys, you've given me something to think about, lets hope mine brain works too Big Grin
Keith


You limey's just have to figure out what is the correct side of the road is to drive on .. you all are similarly messed up with combining the metric and imperial system.. at least the USA sticks stubbornly to the antiquated imperial system in it's entirety. Smile

Seriously, you have one pretty and quick rig in that Merlin setup.. it's just a pity that with the aerodynamic design it doesn't lend itself well to an easily adaptable left or right mounting setup at the factory, as per customer preference/country specific road regulations.

An interesting discussion to follow so far..
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sidecarkeith



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 336
Location: yorkshire uk

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 4:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You limey's just have to figure out what is the correct side of the road is to drive on .. you all are similarly messed up with combining the metric and imperial system.. at least the USA sticks stubbornly to the antiquated imperial system in it's entirety.
Imperial, as in Queen as in English Rolling Eyes
Not bringing any of that England V USA stuff on here, we are world sidecarist, with one common love sidecars.
Yes you have advanced sidecar far beyond us, simply because you have the money to pour into it.
Merlin garage, is a full time car boby repair shop with a sideline in sidecars building, they only produce to order.
We don't really have a full time commited sidecar producer, not enough business to have them just sitting in a showroom. It's one thing I admire about you Americans you go for it, live the dream.
Keith
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Bandit Bill



Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 202
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sidecarkeith wrote:

Not bringing any of that England V USA stuff on here, we are world sidecarist, with one common love sidecars.
Yes you have advanced sidecar far beyond us, simply because you have the money to pour into it.
Merlin garage, is a full time car boby repair shop with a sideline in sidecars building, they only produce to order.
We don't really have a full time commited sidecar producer, not enough business to have them just sitting in a showroom. It's one thing I admire about you Americans you go for it, live the dream.
Keith


All in jest my friend, we got nothing.. I'm Canadian Smile

Even Hannigan Sidecars decided to split for sunnier climates in 1990.
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sidecarkeith



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 336
Location: yorkshire uk

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't worry it was taken that way, just didn't want to get sidelined, from what to me is an interesting and educational topic Cool

Will catch up later it's 4.30 am here and I've to get some sleep Big Grin
Great talking to you.
Keith
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swaybar2002



Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 380
Location: Central Pa.

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Merlin ever desides to make a right mount chair the 'Merlin Mirror' has a good ring to it don't you think.
Sorry for this really stupid post it comes with practice. Embarassed
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Claude Stanley

Founder: Internet Sidecar Owners Klub
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SCT/

2007
I.S.O.K Sidecar RON-DEE-VOO III ..
First full weekend in August!! Thursday through Sunday!!
Weikert, Pa ..more details coming
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sidecarkeith



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 336
Location: yorkshire uk

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd stop practising your a really Pro at it Laughing

It took awhile but I see where your coming from Merlin Mirror, you thought about it, didn't you.

Out of all the sidecar companies here I'd say Merlins were the most forward thinking, trouble is he's also the smallest company with very little money to follow his ideas through. Sad

I'd like to see a Merlin body on a Sidewider frame, tasty Cool
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sidecarkeith



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 336
Location: yorkshire uk

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Swaybar, where's Central PA
There's a city near you who's team play in my sidecar colours, because were fans Big Grin
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Paul



Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 182
Location: Utah

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bandit Bill wrote:
at least the USA sticks stubbornly to the antiquated imperial system in it's entirety.


Not really. Most of the decent cars built in the USA (Hondas, Toyotas, Subarus, BMWs, Mercedes, even Saturns) are fully metric.

If the Chinese stopped making inch-standard bolts, the USA would switch to metric within a year Shocked

Bandit Bill wrote:
Seriously, you have one pretty and quick rig in that Merlin setup.. it's just a pity that with the aerodynamic design it doesn't lend itself well to an easily adaptable left or right mounting setup at the factory, as per customer preference/country specific road regulations.


Who cares which side the passenger sits on? I've never seen any regulation at all about it. I'd buy a Merlin as is, or any other British/Australian/Japanese sidecar. In fact, since the main place a sidecar finds a long continuous sharp bend is at a freeway onramp or cloverleaf, having the sidecar on the left would actually improve handling.
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Bandit Bill



Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 202
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, a little reminder to indicate i was saying this in jest.. the topic is starting to swing way off topic. Don't wish to turn it into a pissing contest in the least Confused

Paul wrote:
Bandit Bill wrote:
at least the USA sticks stubbornly to the antiquated imperial system in it's entirety.


Not really. Most of the decent cars built in the USA (Hondas, Toyotas, Subarus, BMWs, Mercedes, even Saturns) are fully metric.



The common denominator there, is that for the most part, the cars listed from the above manufacurers are world market cars, but manufactured in US factories for the North American market. They've all been metric from the start. Saturn, though parent owned by GM, is based on Opel platforms, among other GM owned subsidiarys. GM domestic production still uses Imperial measure, but i'm sure that'll continue to change as the domestic manufacturers continue to try to compete on the world market with increasingly world platform based cars.

Paul wrote:
Bandit Bill wrote:
Seriously, you have one pretty and quick rig in that Merlin setup.. it's just a pity that with the aerodynamic design it doesn't lend itself well to an easily adaptable left or right mounting setup at the factory, as per customer preference/country specific road regulations.


Who cares which side the passenger sits on? I've never seen any regulation at all about it. I'd buy a Merlin as is, or any other British/Australian/Japanese sidecar. In fact, since the main place a sidecar finds a long continuous sharp bend is at a freeway onramp or cloverleaf, having the sidecar on the left would actually improve handling.


I was making the comment because Sidecarkeith indicated Merlin's market is limited by regulatory legislation in the EU market to being right hand mounted, while the UK market is now regulated to the left hand market, with setups manufactured and meant for the right hand side before a certain cut-off date grand-fathered in, in terms of registration legalities. In the North American market, we have no restrictions, more out of bureaucratic ignorance/the low numbers of sidecarists on the road here, than anything else.

Thats my take on it anyway Smile
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sidecarkeith



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 336
Location: yorkshire uk

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blue like I said I took it as a joke, which did make me laugh Very Happy
I was pointing out that we as a nation are amateurs, good ones but still amatuer.
I don't know how big your sidecar manufacturers premises are but most of our lot work out of the space of a double garage.

Which is a pity otherwise Merlins and the like could come over to the USA and sidecars in general could blast forward into the future much quicker.
Keith
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bmcsheehy



Joined: 22 Jan 2005
Posts: 972
Location: Massachusetts USA

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every time I ask the question of the definition, it ends up the same way.
There is no clear explanation of the definition.
Good discussion though.
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High Performance Sidecaring... ...There is nothing "HACKED" about it.
2006 ZX-14 / HANNIGAN HP.
2011 Concourse / California Friendship III.
1936 Ford Fordoor Humpback
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docmike



Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Eastern NC

PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Every time I ask the question of the definition, it ends up the same way.
There is no clear explanation of the definition.



I believe it was a supreme court judge who said they couldn't define pornography, but knew it when they saw it. Maybe that's true for HPS also. Question You just know it when you see it.


Big Grin Cool Laughing Razz
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bmcsheehy



Joined: 22 Jan 2005
Posts: 972
Location: Massachusetts USA

PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes.
I like that.
There is no definition of a HPS, but I know one when I see one.
Very good Mike. Clapping
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Bill
High Performance Sidecaring... ...There is nothing "HACKED" about it.
2006 ZX-14 / HANNIGAN HP.
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1936 Ford Fordoor Humpback
www.Yankee-Engineering.com
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