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docmike
Joined: 27 Jan 2005 Posts: 630 Location: Eastern NC
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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Any of you guys with CHS front ends, what kind of bearings are used where the swing arm (A-arms?) pivot on the bike frame?
I was thinking (dangerous I know) of a design that would use heim joints, but recent posts have led me to question using them. _________________ Mike Currin
93 BMW K1100RS / EML Speed 2000
89 Honda GB 500 (6,700 miles, all original except tires)
67 Triumph 650 chopper
92 Suzuki GS500 (eldest son) |
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zentime
Joined: 22 Jan 2005 Posts: 837 Location: Massachusetts USA
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 8:01 pm Post subject: Re: Center Hub steering |
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Milow wrote: | I have a GL1800 with a Hannigan sidecar and I'm intrested in changing the front to CHS. I've been able to find LL front ends but were do I look to find a CHS frontend for my Goldwing GL1800? |
Milow,
Sorry I don't know of any CHS that is currently available for the GL1800. I saw a picture once of a one off CHS on a 1500 from Japan but that's it.
Bill _________________ CBR1100XX/EZS
1973 MotoGuzzi V7sport
will August ever come............ |
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swaybar2002
Joined: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 380 Location: Central Pa.
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2005 12:20 am Post subject: |
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>>Milow wrote:
I have a GL1800 with a Hannigan sidecar and I'm intrested in changing the front to CHS. I've been able to find LL front ends but were do I look to find a CHS frontend for my Goldwing GL1800? <<
Jay Geise of Dauntless Motors had spoken of making one to maket. I do not know how the progress has been but have also never heard that the project was shelved..so u may want to give him a call.
Go to Google and type in DauntlessMotors.com to get the contact numbers and or email. _________________ Claude Stanley
Founder: Internet Sidecar Owners Klub
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SCT/
2007
I.S.O.K Sidecar RON-DEE-VOO III ..
First full weekend in August!! Thursday through Sunday!!
Weikert, Pa ..more details coming |
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swaybar2002
Joined: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 380 Location: Central Pa.
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2005 12:30 am Post subject: |
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docmike wrote: | Any of you guys with CHS front ends, what kind of bearings are used where the swing arm (A-arms?) pivot on the bike frame?
I was thinking (dangerous I know) of a design that would use heim joints, but recent posts have led me to question using them. |
Mike,
I am curious of that too. Come on guys tell us your secrets.. _________________ Claude Stanley
Founder: Internet Sidecar Owners Klub
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SCT/
2007
I.S.O.K Sidecar RON-DEE-VOO III ..
First full weekend in August!! Thursday through Sunday!!
Weikert, Pa ..more details coming |
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zentime
Joined: 22 Jan 2005 Posts: 837 Location: Massachusetts USA
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2005 12:53 am Post subject: |
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swaybar2002 wrote: | docmike wrote: | Any of you guys with CHS front ends, what kind of bearings are used where the swing arm (A-arms?) pivot on the bike frame?
I was thinking (dangerous I know) of a design that would use heim joints, but recent posts have led me to question using them. |
Mike,
I am curious of that too. Come on guys tell us your secrets.. |
It's no secret. You can use ball joints mounted sideways, bronze bushings, urethane bushings, needle bearing, tapered roller bearings. Basically anything you would use in a swing arm. It just depends on what the packaging situation is. _________________ CBR1100XX/EZS
1973 MotoGuzzi V7sport
will August ever come............ |
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swaybar2002
Joined: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 380 Location: Central Pa.
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2005 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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Bill wrote in reply to the question about swingarm pivot bearings:
>>It's no secret. You can use ball joints mounted sideways, bronze bushings, urethane bushings, needle bearing, tapered roller bearings. Basically anything you would use in a swing arm. It just depends on what the packaging situation is.<<
Okay, but what is the most commonly used and why? What sizes are common for a single arm? Double arm?
Not sure what 'packaging situation ' means???? _________________ Claude Stanley
Founder: Internet Sidecar Owners Klub
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SCT/
2007
I.S.O.K Sidecar RON-DEE-VOO III ..
First full weekend in August!! Thursday through Sunday!!
Weikert, Pa ..more details coming |
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arbalest
Joined: 01 Feb 2005 Posts: 93 Location: Windham
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 5:03 pm Post subject: caster and camber |
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Bill, caster is the same as trail, it can be measured in degrees (of slope) or inches(mm) of trail. I think the correct terminology is trail, if measuring in inches, and caster, if measuring in degrees. They both refer to the degree to which the center of the contact patch "trails" the intersection point of the caster angle, where it intersects the road, and the vertical centerline through the front wheel/tire. Camber is the measurement, in degrees, that the wheel/tire combo, deviates from vertical in the left/right plane. I think. |
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Paul
Joined: 27 Jan 2005 Posts: 182 Location: Utah
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 7:59 pm Post subject: Re: caster and camber |
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arbalest wrote: | Bill, caster is the same as trail, it can be measured in degrees (of slope) or inches(mm) of trail. I think the correct terminology is trail, if measuring in inches, and caster, if measuring in degrees. They both refer to the degree to which the center of the contact patch "trails" the intersection point of the caster angle, where it intersects the road, and the vertical centerline through the front wheel/tire. Camber is the measurement, in degrees, that the wheel/tire combo, deviates from vertical in the left/right plane. I think. |
Caster (or "rake") and trail aren't the same thing. Caster is an angle - the steering head angle - measured in degrees. Trail is a distance - measured in inches.
Think of a leading link front end. The caster is set by the motorcycle frame - nothing you do to the front end will change it. The trail can be easily adjusted by lengthening or shortening the leading link's swingarm length.
Confusion sets in here with a typical telescopic fork, since the two interact. If you change the steering head angle, the trail also changes. If you reduce the front wheel size on a motorcycle - or if you slide the fork tubes up in the triple clamps - then BOTH rake and trail change. The rake gets steeper, and the trail decreases (and the handling of a solo bike gets better). |
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bmcsheehy
Joined: 22 Jan 2005 Posts: 991 Location: Massachusetts USA
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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Trigonometry _________________ Bill
High Performance Sidecaring... ...There is nothing "HACKED" about it.
2006 ZX-14 / HANNIGAN HP.
2011 Concourse / California Friendship III.
2016 Suzuki Bandit 1250s
1936 Ford Fordoor Humpback
www.Yankee-Engineering.com |
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swaybar2002
Joined: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 380 Location: Central Pa.
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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Definitions:
Rake: The angle of the steering head of a motorcycle frame given in degrees.
Trail: The differece on a horizontal plane between a line drawn down through the steering head and a plumb line through the centerline of the front wheel at ground level.
Caster: The amount of steering pivot inclination when viewed from the side described in degrees.
Notes:
With a teloscopic fork or a leading link front end it is more acceptable to talk in terms of rake and trail. Trail being the issue that sidecarists are speaking of(Described in inches or mm). Rake is a set deal as mentioned earlier by Paul and typically is not changed.(we do not need to go there)
When speaking of a center hub or center point steering front end as is common on a HPS rig it is best to speak in terms of caster as it is measured in degrees. The steering head angle is no longer directly related to the front end geomettry in the former manner. It is only acting as a pivot point with a center hub steering.
Caster and trail are not really the same as they are arrived at differently but they do provide the same function which is the self centering effect of the steering.
There is more to all of this but these are the basics. _________________ Claude Stanley
Founder: Internet Sidecar Owners Klub
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SCT/
2007
I.S.O.K Sidecar RON-DEE-VOO III ..
First full weekend in August!! Thursday through Sunday!!
Weikert, Pa ..more details coming |
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