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"A" arm C.H.S.
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kiltedfireman



Joined: 25 May 2008
Posts: 9
Location: Harvard IL USA

PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:19 am    Post subject: camber change Reply with quote

Good point, camber change isn't necessarily a bad thing for us.

I'm reading two books; Tony Foale's book on bike suspension, and Herb Adams' book on chassis design for cars.

The tough part is that Tony is using the pieces we use, but in conventional leaning two wheelers. Herb is talking about flat turning vehicles with A-arms, caster and camber, but there are two front wheels to cancel each other out.

No one directly addresses the odd needs of the sidecarist! That must be what draws some of us to this endeavor.

Bill and Claude, do you guys make your own spindles/uprights, or do you modify car stuff?

Denny
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Paul



Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 182
Location: Utah

PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think having the trail increase as the suspension is used up, like under hard braking, makes the rig more stable.


Quote:
On a solo bike it is the reverse, hard braking reduces trail, making the bike easier to turn and is considered an advantage when setting up for a corner.


Wouldn't it be the same for a sidecar? Or even for an automobile, for that matter? When you're speeding down the straight, trail is good - most people are a fan of high speed stability. But, when you're hard on the brakes entering the next turn, you'd like to be able to turn easily - so less trail is an advantage.

When a stray dog runs out in front of you, it is a good thing to be able to brake hard and swerve at the same time.

Of course, there could be a lengthy discussion about how much the trail should be reduced under braking - but I think some reduction is good.
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cudgel



Joined: 12 May 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Arcadia, Fl

PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in the process of building a rig using a-arm suspension and am treating it like it was a car whose right front wheel fell off and I'm sitting behind the remaining left front wheel. It has zero scrub radius and built in anti-dive. Both front and sidecar wheel are a-arm and have no bump steer. So far I've only been towed to about 35 mph as the fuel tank is not finished yet. It goes and stops straight. We'll see what happens at higher speed soon and I'll report. Bruce. Pictures are in a recent thread by Zentime about a Blackbird.
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kiltedfireman



Joined: 25 May 2008
Posts: 9
Location: Harvard IL USA

PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 3:57 am    Post subject: blackbird Reply with quote

Cudgel,

Nice! I saw the pics, wish I were closer to FLA to see the progress and the tests!

To be honest, the steering linkage gives me a bit of a chill. Is there any appreciable slop in it? I love what you've done, especially the tall structure of the sidecar. I've often wondered why purpose built rigs with custom frames insist on making four connections to the donor motorcycle from one plane (off a standard sidecar frame.) Congrats on building a space frame and spreading the load!

Denny
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kiltedfireman



Joined: 25 May 2008
Posts: 9
Location: Harvard IL USA

PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 8:05 pm    Post subject: TCHS with ball joint above wheel Reply with quote

I was just perusing the Motorcyclist article on James Parker's latest iteration of his RADD front end for motorcycyles. As I was looking at the photos of the different variations he has made over the years, I realized the first one has an upright with the lower ball joint within the wheel, and the upper on a long curving arm ABOVE the tire!

[img]http://www.flickr.com/photos/38491901@N04/3539340551[/img]

Now that I know it's possible, I would simply steepen up the caster/rake angle and hang it off A-Arms off the sidecar frame such as pictured in the Another Blackbird build, a tall space frame.

Someday, if my divorce is EVER finalized....

Denny[/url]
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